513. Expand, Don’t Shrink: Living Bigger in the Second Half of Life with Kristin Andrus

What if the secret to a more connected marriage, thriving relationships with your kids, and a deeper sense of purpose was found in expanding, not shrinking in the second half of life?

In this episode, I sit down with the ever-inspiring Kristin Andrus to talk about why now is the time for women to step forward, not fade back. We explore the power of contribution, how showing up in your community can actually strengthen your closest relationships. And we dive into Kristin’s beautiful new cookbook created not just to feed your family, but to fuel an incredible cause. This conversation is a must listen for anyone who’s ready to grow bigger, bolder, and more intentional with their life. Welcome to episode 513, Expand, Don’t Shrink, Living Bigger in the Second Half of Life with Kristin Andrus.

Welcome to Better Than Happy, the podcast where we transform our lives by transforming ourselves. My name is Jody Moore. In the decade-plus I’ve been working with clients as a Master Certified Coach, I’ve helped tens of thousands of people to become empowered. And from empowered, the things that seemed hard become trivial, and the things that seemed impossible become available, and suddenly, a whole new world of desire and possibility open up to you. And what do you do with that?

Well, that’s the question… what will you do? Let’s find out.

Sometimes, listening to a podcast is enough. But sometimes, you’ll feel inspired to go deeper. If you hear things that speak to you in today’s episode, consider it your invitation to a complimentary coaching workshop.

On this live, interactive Zoom call with me, you’ll get a taste of the power of this work when applied in real life. You can participate, or be a silent observer. But you have to take a step if you want to truly see change in your life… two steps, actually. Head to JodyMoore.com/freecoaching and register. Then you just have to show up. Your best life is waiting for you. Will you show up for it? JodyMoore.com/freecoaching. I’ll see you there.

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Jody: Okay. Kristin Andrus, we have on the podcast. I can’t believe I haven’t got you on the podcast before now. What have we been doing?

Kristin: I was thrilled. We were talking, we were chatting and texting and you said, would you want to come on? And within two seconds, I was like, yes.

Jody: I’m so excited. It’s so fun to have you here. All right, why don’t you go ahead and introduce yourself? How do you explain to people who you are and what you’re doing in the world? All the millions of things.

Kristin: First and foremost, I’m a mother of six. That is definitely where my lack and my growth lies. But they are so much fun. I’m in this, I call it the sacred spot of my oldest is 17. I have four girls and then we had surprise identical twin boys who turn nine next week. And so, you know, I’m not fearful of pregnancy or, you know, like anything major. It’s just kind of like everyone’s still under my roof and there’s no diapers. There’s very little dating so far. So I just feel like we’re in this really sweet, sacred spot before everything’s going to turn upside down and they start leaving me.

Jody: Is your oldest a junior?

Kristin: She’s a junior. Yeah.

Jody: So you got another year with her.

Kristin: Truthfully, I’m so excited for her. I see so many friends who are just besides themselves. They’re so sad that their kids are leaving. And I’m like, this is so exciting. This is great. And I turned to my mom once when I kind of started noticing all these friends were so sad that their kids were leaving the home and I said, were you sad when I went to college? And she’s like, not at all. I was so happy for you. And I thought, I think that’s how I’m going to be.

Jody: Okay, what do you think is the difference though for you? Because I have some guesses about why you’re obviously you’re going to miss your daughter when she leaves, but you’re more excited.

Kristin: I’m excited because she finally has the opportunity to learn on her own. You know, we try to not be hovering parents, but there is something about being in a home and not learning the lessons on your own. So I know that she has the skills, she has the capabilities. She is ready to fly and do incredible things and fall, right? Both. And truthfully, I am very full and satisfied in my life personally as a woman. And so I am not looking to her to fill my cup.

I turned to her high school when they started asking me to do all these things and I said, I love you, but I don’t love your high school. You know, I’m actually going to turn to this Title One school and help them because your school is over saturated with so much help. So I haven’t attached myself to her and her life and her interests. I love her. I cheerlead her on and I’m her friend and her parent, but that’s it. And so I’m really excited for her to go and she get to try it out on her own.

Jody: That’s so awesome. Yeah, you’ve built this full life where you’re engaged in so many things that you’re interested in and passionate about. And so and this is by no means to say that everybody’s lives should look the same, of course. Not everybody should be having a job or doing volunteer work or whatever, but we all have desires and interests and passions. And if we tell ourselves we can’t do that, we don’t have time. We have to be at, I was just coaching a woman this morning who’s like volunteering at the school, but she has these other passions. And I’m like, that’s your job to acknowledge your passion. Doesn’t mean you don’t serve, but you serve in the way that you feel called to serve and you have to be able to do exactly what you did, Kristin. I love you, but I don’t love this school. I need to go help somewhere else or I feel called to something else.

Kristin: I mean, that’s my own congregation as well. Like it’s funny close to home. If you knew me just in my neighborhood, you’d think I’m probably not very interested. I don’t really lean in. I’m not very helpful. Like that is what you would see close, but then when you scale out where my interests lie are outside of my little bubble of Holladay, Utah, where I live, and I go all in. And thank goodness. What, you know, what if we all did it the same way?

Jody: Yeah, we need some people to be working locally, of course. Tell us about some of those other things that you’re doing outside of your bubble.

Kristin: Yeah, so I have the privilege and I and I do think it’s a privilege to wake up every day and decide how I want to lean in and help in the community and fill gaps. My day job, I guess I would say is philanthropy. I love working with nonprofits. I love bringing them together and having them work closer together. I come in from an interesting angle where I’m a donor and I try to help them financially, but I’m also kind of a boots on the ground. I rally volunteers. I bring women together who, you know, want to do more and are and are looking for that. 

I’ve started doing these gatherings every quarter. And I’m sure we’ll get into that and these women looking at the second season of life and what does this look like? And so I feel really grateful that one, I have a platform on social media where I can rally, you know, hundreds of women and bring them together and bring speakers like you and others to try to help them. And then really my focus is on the most vulnerable. 

And so a couple things have been brought to my attention lately and it was around, you know, mental health for kind of middle class, you know, families. And I hope someone’s doing that, but I told my husband this morning in the car, this is not for me. Like, I’m only interested in getting mental health help for those who cannot afford it. I’m only interested in helping those families that are, you know, barely hanging on. So it’s interesting where we all kind of come in with our passions, but every day I’m asking myself, how can I help? How can I lean in? What can I do to actually make impact in my little part of the world? 

And I will say, I had a conversation this morning with a woman who said, how are you doing everything? Because I’m everywhere doing everything. And I said, I outsource, and this is once again, such a privilege. I outsource everything in my home. I do not grocery shop. I do not do my laundry. Like I outsource everything that I don’t need to be there for. And then I have the privilege of doing more than any one woman could generally do because I get so much help. 

You know, I think sometimes like that Shonda Rhimes of, you know, putting on the wig that we pretend that we’re doing it all. And I miss kids games. You know, tomorrow I have a book event. I’m missing two of my kids’ soccer games and lacrosse games. I’m always sacrificing something, right? If I’m in the community doing something amazing, I’m missing something with my family. And if I’m with my family, showing up for my kids, I’m missing something in the community. It’s never all okay. You know, we’re just juggling everything, but for me having that full cup of impact and charity work, it is who I am and why I think God put me on this earth. And so it’s really important to me.

Jody: That’s so good. A couple questions. I want you to speak to what you would say to the woman that says, that’s great. I want to pursue what I feel called to do and help and serve in whatever way or go after my goals and dreams. I don’t have the means to outsource everything in my home. I know that’s a scalable example that you’re giving.

Kristin: So what’s so interesting about this with women is they, I think see it as an all or nothing. So I need to go and, you know, volunteer at the food bank every day and do all of this stuff. And I would say it’s not, you know, getting out there in the community, find what your passion is. Like, were you raised by a single mom? Do you love animals? Are you worried? I’m in, you know, Salt Lake City. Are you worried about the Great Salt Lake? Like, there are a thousand issues that you can look into. So one, do your research, follow them on social media. You know, or try it out. Test things out. Go there and volunteer. Did that mean anything to you?

So once you kind of find something, go there, volunteer once. Also, something like this could be inviting a single mom in your neighborhood or an elderly woman in your neighborhood on a walk, right? Like I have friends who are so amazing at being kindness spreaders and really just paying attention to the one in our neighborhood and I miss it. I miss it every single time. Like I am not that woman that shows up locally like we just mentioned. But thank goodness there are and they are so important. 

I have this darling friend Annie who lives four doors down. I was living here for four years. She’s in a wheelchair. She is just sunlight. I love her so much. I lived four doors down from her for four years and I never met her. I never got to know her. And four years in, I sat down with her, I went to her house and got to know her and I thought, what have I been missing right in front of my face for four years to get to know the brightest light, you know, in my local congregation and four doors down because I was so busy five miles away. 

And so it doesn’t have to be another thing on your to-do list. It’s adding in looking outwards, filling gaps, doing what you can, using your unique skills and talents, right? So like I’m a gatherer. I love that. But some people are more of a one-on-one, they’re a teacher, mentor, you know, they could, you know, find so many different things. So I would say one, what is your passion? Really lean into that. That is part of the work. You know, the journey is the destination in terms of this. 

And how much time do you have? Is it an hour a week? And by the way, if you’re scrolling social media, if you watch Netflix, I would just ask yourself, do I actually have more time, you know, than I think? Sometimes, if you’re folding laundry, it’s calling your mom. It’s calling someone that needs a conversation. It can be built into what you’re doing. It’s not always a project. I think when we make it a project, it’s this thing you have to get in your car and go to. That sometimes is the case, but other times it’s not. 

And the last thing I would say is ask other people what they’re doing and go and join them or ask other women to join you. Instead of going to lunch with your girlfriend, go to the foster care center and put bags together. There’s so many things that you can do incorporating it into your daily life or your company. If you work full time, let them know, I’m super interested in getting involved in service. You know, refugees really speak to me. I would, is there something I could help with, you know? And so incorporate it. Don’t add it into like laundry, grocery shopping, giving back. It’s in the grocery store, right? It’s just all of those things.

Jody: And what I notice from watching you and from what you’ve been saying even here today is that you do it because you feel excited and passionate and called to do it. And you’re not doing it because you have this I should. And a lot of women are, especially women anyway, I feel like are operating from that place. I know I should make time for service. You’re right. If I’m watching Netflix, I should be serving. 

And I just want to say that I don’t think this is a should thing. You’re probably already doing plenty of service in your family and whatever and it’s fine. What we’re saying is that this does something going after and contributing in a way that you’re excited about contributing does something for our spirits and our souls. I remember, you know, we’re taught this at the LDS church that the best way to, you know, get over feeling bad is to go serve someone else. But I remember being, I think I was graduated from college, but I was single and just kind of feeling lost. Like wanted to be married and starting a family, but that wasn’t happening. And so I was working at this job that I didn’t love and just kind of like feeling like I should I’m supposed to be doing more than this. 

And I thought it was, you know, being a mom and having kids. That wasn’t on the horizon. And so I didn’t know what to do, but I thought, I’m just going to go sign up to be a big brother, big sister. That was the only thing I was even like aware of and did took no time to do any research. And I thought, I’m just going to go, I’ll be a big sister, right? And so they gave me this little sister, who was this girl who her mom was a single mom and she was fine, you know, wasn’t like she didn’t have food to eat or whatever. Her mom just didn’t have time to really spend a lot of time with her. And so I would just take her out once a week. We’d go for ice cream, we’d go to a movie. We, you know, it was like so nothing. It really was nothing. 

But it really did pull me out of this like poor me. I thought I would have a husband by now. I thought I was supposed to be having children. And, you know, probably lasted less than a year. But I to this day, I’m like, that is the key. Like when I’m feeling bad about my life or myself, I have to stop thinking about myself. It’s just the fastest way out of it. 

And so if you do that ongoing and maybe it’s through a job, maybe it’s through a business. I will say as you’re giving all these great examples of just like raise your hand, volunteer, go help. There’s a lot of coaches that listen to this podcast too, who want to be coaching, but haven’t quite got their groove in their business yet. And I’m like, do you know how much good you can do with coaching? Go downtown to the women’s shelter and offer free coaching. Go to the school and coach the teacher, go to the Title One school and coach the teachers there. Like go coach people. It will improve your coaching. You contribute in this way. You’re doing something you love that you feel called to do. It’s just a win for everybody to use whatever skills you have, whatever you feel called to do.

Kristin: That is exactly right. And I love the word. I’ve been trying to veer away from the word service. And you nailed it to contribution. Because it is how do we contribute? If I’m caring for elderly parents, I’m not going to be showing up to the food bank tomorrow, right? If I have a newborn, like it is our contribution. And I love that. 

And I had a couple of examples as you had sent me, you know, what we’d be talking about today. And one that strikes me that exactly what you said is a dermatologist reached out to me and she said, I want to do more. I have a little practice. What can I do? And I said, oh my gosh, there are so many teens, vulnerable teens out there that you could help. So she put on an acne clinic. And it was a free acne clinic. She brought in once again, don’t go at it alone. Bring others along with you. 

She brought all of these other female dermatologists. They set up in a place and had foster teens and teens that could not afford going to a dermatologist helped them with their skin care. There are so many incredible examples of don’t go and try to do something like I’m not going to go coach someone because I’m not a coach. But if that’s in my skill set and the way that it opens your life and the richness, the purpose, you know, when someone said to me, I remember driving this huge van full of all of this canned food for winter break. 

And I get out of the car and someone’s like, Kristin, like, why are you doing this? And I stopped. It was like freezing in Utah. And I’m like, do you know what my gut answer was? You can only host so many girlfriend lunches. Like, how many tablescapes fill my life? Like that it wasn’t because God, you know, it wasn’t this altruistic. It was like, I just can’t host another girlfriend lunch because I need more depth, more purpose. 

And, you know, doing stuff for your church is great, but to your point, it’s duty. And where I tried to turn women because we are duty bound. The responsibilities, we the stewardship we feel, but when we do it out of duty, it doesn’t change our hearts. When we move service and contribution from duty and we move it to joy. And when you use your unique skills and you show up with your talents, do it in your unique God-given way. That is joy. It’s no longer duty. And we’ve got to move through that continuum.

Jody: That’s so good. I love that your word for the year is expansion. And I know you feel strongly as do I about this idea of expansion, especially for women, especially members of the LDS church. Can you talk about why you feel that’s so necessary to talk about?

Kristin: So what’s fascinating, and you understand this, is I have, you know, friends like a lot of us do and we hear from them. But when you’re on social media, you hear from thousands of women all of the time. And so I feel like I have this really unique insight into women today. And it’s this second season of life. 

And so what I hear from women is that their kids are all in school or their kids are out of the home and they’ve never really been told or modeled that there is something after they raise their kids. Yeah. Then they’re shocked at like, oh my gosh, the second season of life is actually going to be longer or just as long as I was in this season of raising kids. And when we’re we have newborns and sleepless nights and toddler tantrums, you know, we’re sitting at play dates and the moms love to talk about it, right? 

And then our kids get older and we’re quieter. We don’t talk about our teens as much. We don’t talk about our adult kids and for many valid reasons. But that quiet along with this second season that we’re not prepared for leaves a lot of us feeling more alone, more vulnerable, honestly, more depressed and really not knowing what to do than we’ve ever been before. 

By the way, this is typical. Like this is happening. You are not. I think everyone thinks they’re the only one feeling this and they’re not alone. So many women are feeling this. And so I was at an event and I asked women, it was full of like, honestly, three or four hundred women. And I said, do you feel that your most important work is ahead of you or behind you? They raised their hands. 90% of the women like us felt like their most important work was behind them. They’re 45, 50, 55 years old and their greatest work is behind them. 

That was sad to me and alarming to me and concerning to me to be quite honest. And so as I talked to all of these women who are saying, how do I get involved? How what do I do? I am lost, I’m alone. You know, husband’s still working or whatever it may be, kids are gone and I’m alone. I’m lonely. I start talking about this word of expansion. And it’s easier to contract. It’s easier to go small, right? 

Kids are gone. Kids are in school and we stay home and we contract and we get smaller. And it’s not one day of contraction. It’s day after day after day. And finally, what we are comfortable with is contraction and going smaller and staying home and not reaching out rather than every day getting uncomfortable and saying, how do I expand today? 

By the way, expanding could be asking a friend on a walk. It’s not some big massive movement, you know. It is little moments of deciding that you’re not going to go small, that you are going to show up. And by the way, if you’re not wanting to do it for yourself, and you’ve been home and focused on your children, please do it as a model for your daughters and your sons. You can’t continue to raise our children and our girls especially to say, you’re going to be a mom. And then we’re silent about the next second season of life. 

Richard Rohr, who I love, a Franciscan priest, talks a lot about this first, you know, season of life and the second season. And the first is building and creating. And the second season can be so beautiful. We take everything we learned, everything we’ve become, all of the lessons and insights gained and we get to then go and flourish and make impact and do incredible things. And women, especially, understand. They understand families, they understand hardship, right? And to see women contracting, I just know there is something so big and bold and beautiful for women if they lean into that discomfort, they get out of their heads, right? The crazy roommate, as you talk about every day, who’s telling them you’re small, you, you know. 

And it’s hard to make friends. I will absolutely say in the second season of life, hard to keep friends, hard to make friends. So you’ve got to be out there and that’s the expansion is inviting a new friend to lunch. It’s so uncomfortable. But do you know what’s more uncomfortable? Contracting and becoming smaller.

Jody: And I think in my experience anyway, from watching a lot of people is the discomfort of contracting is like a small, dull pain that over time, I don’t feel good. I don’t like my life. I don’t feel like I have purpose. I’m depressed, whatever, versus the discomfort of expansion, sometimes feels more painful because it might be it might be scary. It might be might be bigger in moments here and there, but it’s also the pain of progression and the pain of movement versus the pain of stagnation. 

And so they’re different types of pain and one feels literally expansive and one feels like a stuck stagnation. But you’re right, it’s uncomfortable either way. I do pay attention to this because I’m 50 now. I’m going to be 51 this year. My kids are starting to leave the house. I’m being confronted with all of this like, you know, what is next? Is my business going to evolve in a certain way or like what am I doing here, right? In the second half of life. 

And it is uncomfortable and it’s a bit of an identity crisis and I think you have to make space for all of that. But I pay attention to older women who are still vibrant and active and living the kind of life that I hope to live because I’m trying to like you said, find models of that. And my mom was very active in a lot of ways too, but I’m just looking for lots of examples of what might it look like. And a couple things I’ve noticed. 

First of all, I heard Martha Stewart recently, right? And whether you like Martha Stewart or not, whatever, but I don’t think we could deny she’s been successful a lot of her goals, right? And she’s still out there pretty vibrant. I can’t remember how old she is now, but she’s out there living her life. And she said the other day, somebody asked her how she stays this way. She said, I learn something new every day. Like continuing to learn, right? 

And it reminded me of I have a class right now of where I’m training coaches. So I have a whole group of women and one really brave man who are learning, yeah, who are learning coaching and they’re going to become coaches, right? And there’s a woman in there who’s 80 years old. And she asked me, do you think it’s a good idea for me to sign up for this coach training? You know, and she has some clients already and she does some coaching, but she wanted to add these additional skills. And I was like, do you want to learn this stuff? And she said, yeah, and we went on a hike one day because I had them all here for a workshop. And her name is Diane. She’s amazing. Hi, Diane. I love you. I said, Diane, are you going to be okay on this hike? She’s like, yeah. Like, why wouldn’t I be? 

She’s physically thriving. She’s mentally thriving. She’s emotionally thriving. And again, there’s a lot of factors that impact that stuff. But she continues to go out and learn and do what she’s interested in doing. And I really do think that’s the key to longevity in our lives.

Kristin: Absolutely. And a positive consequence of doing this for ourselves as women is that it improves our marriages. Right? As we are doing well on our own, we’re thriving, we’re learning, we’re taking a class, we’re moving, we’re expanding. I promise you, you will be happier in your marriage, right? 

You’re not turning to him and saying, you know, why aren’t you home or whatever it may be. With kids, we’re not waiting for the phone call. Everyone in your life will be happier. They’ll be seeing you be happier. So you’re modeling it, you’re happier and then it actually improves all of your relationships. And so I think that’s an unintended consequence of investing in ourselves, expanding, doing what this woman is doing is that all of a sudden everything’s better.

Jody: Yeah. I’ve watched you a little bit just from the little bit I’ve seen online and knowing you in your marriage too. And my sister and I even had a conversation about this. We’re like, Kristin and Jeremy, like you guys appear perfect and I know you’re not perfect. I know you try to be very transparent about that as well. But, you know, we were just talking about how awesome it is that you have created what you wanted and needed to be fulfilled so that you’re not dependent on your husband to fulfill you. And like your husband’s very successful, you’re very successful and you guys are successful together. What advice do you have for people?

Kristin: So it wasn’t always that way. In the very beginning, he was very busy, always traveling. I was totally passive aggressive or, you know, maybe aggressive looking back. Why are you leaving again? Why are you going to be gone? And I just remember being just always kicking against the pricks. 

And one day he came to me early on, we he was running Skull Candy, that headphone company. This was many years ago. And he said, what do you want? Like, what do you want? And then I realized, I have a choice in this. He said, I can’t do this without you. I can become a librarian. Do you want this or not? And I was like, oh, I do want this. I do want this for our family. I do want what this looks like and maybe what this leads to. 

So from that moment on, I literally changed my thoughts and my brain, right? So circumstances were the same. He was still working a lot. He was still traveling, but I changed my thoughts and my brain and thought, I’m in. We’re a team. This is what we’re doing. And from that moment on, I became, not only was I like his supporter, I was my biggest advocate. And I spoke my needs out loud. I told him about my hopes and dreams. I asked for my family’s support out loud, right? My interests in philanthropy at the time, you know, were just as important as his needs at work and what he needed. 

And so when he was, like you said, he was doing well, winning all the awards. And I was on this trajectory of trying to figure out what I cared about. He supported me as much as I supported him. We’re also both very good on our own. So I’m truthfully, I’m not very needy. Like I don’t need a lot out of him, but the partnership I do. And so when he’s 100% and I’m 100%, then we can come together. And the pain is in our thoughts. And when we know that we’re trying our best, we show up for each other, we speak kindly about each other behind our backs. It’s like it’s a really, really amazing marriage. It just is. 

By the way, I married a good human, right? So start with a good human. I’m decent. But when you marry a good human and you, you know, can change your thoughts and come together as a team, and I’m never ever looking to him or my kids to fulfill me. I haven’t for 15 years and that has made all the difference. I am totally great on my own and hit and miss with the kids and everything else.

Jody: No, it’s yeah, it’s the ideal. Let’s talk about, I wanted to pick your brain a little bit about perfectionism and people pleasing because I think especially for someone like you that has a really big following online. I know, I see you intentionally try to show people like the messy days in your house and I see you like trying to be real. But it still looks like you’re doing it perfectly if I can be honest. I’m like, she’s even perfect at being vulnerable and real. 

Kristin: I’m already regretting telling you guys earlier that I like hire stuff out. But that is the truth. Yeah. The truth is I am not doing that. And so I have a whole another person doing my life, right? 

Jody: Let me ask you a couple questions. I’m just curious if… because to be able to do all the things you’re doing, even with hiring out the home stuff and all of that, still, you cannot do that amount of quality work and try to be perfect at it all. It’s just not possible, right? Like perfectionism just really slows us down. 

And Kristin Andres does not move slow, I notice. Like you’ll have event after event and then a book launch and then like you’re just way too busy to be a perfectionist. Have you ever struggled with perfectionism? And whether you have or not, talk to us about how you think about things that keeps you out of that.

Kristin: Yeah. So for one, I do looking around me and to all my friends I love and the world. It’s like I think I was truly born with a very large bandwidth. Like I just I just was. Number two, I have always been so good with 80%. Like I look at my kids who are getting really good grades. Like I got decent grades because I cared about social. I cared about synchronized swimming back in high school. I was like pretty good, but I never worked so hard because I cared about friends. 

I’ve always been really satisfied and content at about 80%. I joked in the beginning of the podcast about parenting at 80%. It’s probably like 60%. But I try to get to maybe 60% to 80% of my kids’ stuff. You know, my events are great, but they’re definitely not perfect. And what I will say is I actually like, I like people coming in and saying she maybe could have catered that, but she made her own lemon curd pudding. You know, like I want it to be grounded. I don’t, you know, I don’t want it to be fancy and over the top. And some things I like nice things. And by the way, that’s about me, you know, not about you. But perfectionism for me, I have no interest. Those that I see trying to be perfect, one, of course, I feel like they’re wasting so much time. And then in the perfect moment, it’s never is exactly that. Right. 

And so it’s fun to like to show the mess and have fun with it and show up and do your best. And to me, I would rather be present and there and, you know, get to something than having it be perfect and do half of the stuff. Like I love people. I love gathering. I love all those things so much that if I had waited to make it perfect or even my Instagram, like whatever it may be, I would do nothing. I spoke to 500 trip leaders, HXP this morning. And I know that so many of them get stuck in this like, I’m not good enough. I’m not married or I’m not there yet. I don’t have the house to then invite people over. And I just see women getting so stuck trying to make it look good. 

And this is what I’ve learned about people pleasing that I find fascinating. It’s actually a selfish thing. When you are a people pleaser, you’re not worried about them. You’re worried about you. Yes. I’m not worried about me. Like, I know people say things about me. If I was so vanilla that no one said anything about me, like good night. I don’t even want to be putting myself out there. Like I hope I’m pushing people. I’m not trying to please people. I’m trying to nudge people. I’m trying to push people into a little bit of discomfort like you do.

Jody: How do you let go of the part of the human condition that wants everybody to like us? Because clearly, like you are confident enough that you understand everyone’s not going to be, you know, your fan and that’s not even your intention. That’s not why you’re doing this work to win fans. Has that always come natural to you?

Kristin: I think it has. Also with this social media platform, when people push back on me, they’re mean to me, if I come back with a kind response, nine times out of 10, they apologize that they were in a bad place and they are so sorry and they are so embarrassed. And I don’t think it’s about them. I know that their thoughts about me are their issue, not my issue. And I know not everyone’s going to like me because I don’t I don’t like everyone. You know, like I have some dear friends that I love in person and, you know, their online persona is different or whatever it may be. And I can’t show up as anybody but just who I am. Like I’m out there, I’m loud, I’m could be aggressive. I’m a big, I just don’t stop. And like take it or leave it. I that’s all I can do, you know?

Jody: I want my kids to like me, but they half the time don’t. So as much as I try for that. And that whole thing of like, if everybody likes you, how boring is that? I truly think that’s so boring. You’re doing something wrong if everybody likes you.

Kristin: We’re constantly changing yourself for the people that you’re with if everybody likes you because that’s the only way, right? Even that’s challenging enough to do it, probably doesn’t work. But just one other thing I was going to say for anybody that’s like, well, that doesn’t come naturally for me. It is something that you can work on. And I love bringing on people like Kristin just to show more examples of what it looks like because I think we think, well, that’s arrogant if I just don’t care what people think, then I’m selfish and I’m whatever. And you’re such a good example of like so giving, so generous, looking out for people and not doing it because you’re trying to win approval. 

The thing that for me really tipped me over the edge of getting to that place is realizing, like you said, when somebody doesn’t like me, they have a negative comment online or whatever, that’s 100% about them. But when people do like me, when they tell me that I changed their life or that they’re so grateful for what I did and they think it’s so amazing, that’s also about them. And that’s what set me free. I was like, wait a second, none of it’s about me. Whether they love me or they hate me, it’s about them. And then you just become free to decide, do I like me? And if not, why am I not being the person that I want to be? And how do I be the person that I like? And also recognize that I’m not perfect and I have faults and can I be okay with that?

Kristin: That is profound. No, I had a woman at a cookbook event last night come and tell me that she went to one of my events and then she bought a business and she just it just set her free and I changed her life. And I was like, oh, you know, it made me so happy. But it absolutely was all about her.

Jody: Yes.

Kristin: I love that. Cuz you can’t take both, right?

Jody: No. Because if it was about you, everybody who read your cookbook would be out there doing these amazing things. And even the fact that they would come up and tell me that they would take the time, because I used to have a hard time with it at first when people would come up to me and be like, oh my gosh, you saved my marriage. And my brain would go, wow, you really fooled them. Like they if only they knew that you’re actually you have all these problems. I had this like bully in my head. And so it was very exhausting. 

So I was constantly like, I don’t want to see people. I don’t want to talk to people, right? And what I realized through coaching eventually was like, no, that’s not about you either. And we do though kind of like need a place sometimes to put our gratitude towards or a person or a or a church or whatever that we like associate with something that has helped us. And they’re associating me with that. 

And maybe I was the vehicle that said something that helped them. And so I can just graciously hold that space for them because it’s kind of a like a nice part of their experience even just being able to thank me for it. And so, but what I think in my head is like, wow, what a cool lady that took this cookbook and went and ran with it. That says so much about her and that she was brave and that then she would take the time to come up and tell me that, that requires a certain level of courage and vulnerability. And like, what a cool woman.

Kristin: For sure. Yeah. On the flip side, this is what I did. I go back to like kind of that negativity on the opposite of Kristin, you’re a white savior, right? Like you are, you know, you’re just doing this for the picture. When I got that feedback and how I started figuring out how to handle that, especially online, because that’s mostly where you get a lot of this stuff, was what is the truth? Because we know. We know when we get feedback and it’s negative, whether it’s a spouse, family or online, what is the kernel of truth if there is? Some there’s none. 

And I’ll read something or get the feedback and I’m like, they are crazy. They are sad in their life. I’m so sorry. I hope you’re doing okay. But there are some and a lot that have a kernel of truth. And so when I can take that kernel of truth and see it and say, even if they said it disrespectfully or they were mean, they were right. And I can actually do better. And so if I can learn from those, then I can refine myself. 

I always want to learn. I’m always wanting to learn something new every day. I’m always wanting to do that and get better and refine myself. So that, especially with negative feedback is hard to take, but then I dismiss the rest. Was I taking pictures in an inappropriate place or whatever, that is right. I shouldn’t do that again. I’m not going to take pictures with little kids faces. Lesson learned. The rest I can… I’m not going to carry that with me just like I’m not going to carry the positive feedback with me all day.

Jody: Yeah. That’s so good. And you’ll know if there’s a kernel of truth because it triggers you a little bit. Yes. If it doesn’t trigger you, it does feel just like you said like, okay, whatever, that person’s having a bad day. But if you feel a little triggered, it might mean that they’re right in that situation, right? That particular post or whatever, maybe you were like, I should change that thing in the future. But sometimes what I find is it’s like, I’ll get accused of things like, you know, not spending enough time with my children. 

And usually, like I sent this email about school buses, how awesome they are and we take them for granted and they take my kids to school and save me all this time and then I got a bunch of emails about how awful it is that I put them on the school bus and I should be driving them to school and all this, right? And it triggered me a little bit. And so I was like, is it true that I don’t think I should be putting my kids on the school bus? No. But what is true is I can be selfish with my time and I could do a better job as a mother. 

And so a lot of times that’s what I find is like, they think I’m dropping the ball as a mom because I put them on the school bus. They don’t know the half of it. I’m dropping the ball in so many other even bigger ways. This is nothing. But they just trigger that part of me. And so then I can just make peace with when they’re like, you’re selfish with your time. I can just say, yeah, sometimes true. I mean, what do you I’m also very generous with my time sometimes and I’m a good mom sometimes. Like anyway.

Kristin: I moved to Utah and I’m like, I get babysitters. You know, I just kind of said like this is who I am and everyone’s like, But then they didn’t really have much to say anymore because it’s like, oh wow.

Jody: Because it’s not a secret and you’re not trying to hide it or defend it. It’s just, yeah, it’s just very boring. Yeah. Okay. So I want to talk about you have the most beautiful cookbook, which by the way, we’re both Moores.

Kristin: Yes.

Jody: Right? When I got it, I was like, Kristin personalized this cookbook for me. It says Moore Family cookbook. I’m like, oh wait, no, she didn’t. I’m just going to pretend. I want to hear more about the like what brought this about anyway. And everyone, I think it’s probably hard to get. It keeps selling out. But we’ll get more. 

One of the things I think would be cool to loop in as you talk about this cookbook and why you decided to do this project and I love that you’re what you’re doing with the proceeds. Tell us about all of that. But you are probably the best connector of anyone I’ve ever seen. Like you are so good at, like you said, connecting people both in big ways through events and in smaller personal ways. 

And a part of that is, I think, you know, for the average woman like myself that isn’t putting on big massive events, but wants to connect people like that. I think gathering also. I mean, I know like you said, you got to a point where you’re like, you can only do so many table escapes, but you do beautiful table escapes, beautiful charcuterie boards and all the things. And I think it what maybe started as social or for some of us, it can be social and enjoyable and can turn into something even more meaningful and powerful. So will you just kind of speak to that topic and your cookbook?

Kristin: Yeah, so I grew up in a home. I’m from Walnut Creek, California. I was raised there my whole life until I left for college in a home where we, you know, had a long table, meaning like everyone was always invited. My parents’ language of love was absolutely inviting and gathering, hosting Christmas parties. 

I remember, you know, looking over the balcony and my parents having all of their friends over in this beautiful Christmas party and my mom made all of the desserts and all of the appetizers. And so our home was a place of gathering. My dad barbecued and he mentored kids and they were just always the first to, you know, show up and sign up and volunteer and in smaller ways, right? They weren’t throwing bashes of 400 people, but they just always invited people over and our home was a place of gathering. And so that’s was modeled for me. It’s what I grew up with. 

And so as my siblings and I, you know, got older, we also started gathering and I think people look at what I do today, especially on social and they’re like, well, yeah, I mean, of course she does. But, you know, I had a tiny sugar house bungalow in Salt Lake City. We moved in as newlyweds in this tiny house and I was like, we’re going to throw a Christmas party because that’s what you do. 

And Jeremy, my husband who did not grow up in a family that ever hosted, ever entertained was like, we don’t know anyone. And I’m like, we will because we’re going to invite them to our Christmas party. I brought, you know, invited 30 people and I laugh because I got a trumpet player and it was so small that like the trumpet player couldn’t even put his like horn out because someone would have like walked by the trumpet player. And I did a honeybaked ham and a little broccoli salad. I have a picture of it and it was so cute. Like I’m so proud of myself that 20 years ago I’m like, I don’t know anyone. I want to make friends. And Jeremy pace like no one’s going to come. I can’t believe we’re doing this. There is no way we could host a Christmas party. We don’t know anyone. 

And I think we’re at year 19. Wow. We host a Christmas party because we are known as gatherers. And I didn’t wait until we had a big enough house. Like we had a jimmy rigged, you know, the lamp and like we had to no one fit. People were sitting on my bed eating. Like that was the reality. But that didn’t stop me because I just wanted to have people over. And if you ask people who are at this Christmas party year 19 or year one, they say year one was just as good as year 19. Because it’s the feeling, right? 

It’s not waiting for the perfect food or can I get nice flowers? It’s really just about inviting people to your table. They don’t care what they’re eating. They really don’t. They don’t care if your house is clean or not. When I am invited to someone’s home or to the park or whatever it may be, I am just so thrilled to be invited. I actually don’t care about the details. I actually think as hosts, it’s that they care about the details. It’s not necessary for the guests.

So as my parents are in their 70s and I’ve kind of looked at this beautiful life that they, you know, gave to us and that we’re now carrying on in the next generation. We don’t have a lot of, you know, we’re, you know, members of the church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints, but we don’t have like pioneer heritage and all of this family history. We’re just that’s not either side of my family. And so I thought, what is our legacy? Like what is my parents’ gift and love language of the world and it is gathering and connecting and food. 

And so two Thanksgivings ago, I put a PowerPoint presentation together and I think they thought I was going to give them all like the gift of a lifetime, you know, like my brother’s like, I thought you were taking us on a trip. And I’m like, you guys, I’m going to we’re going to write a family cookbook and everyone’s like, like, what? 

Jody: Should we go on a trip after? 

Kristin: Exactly. And so I knew then what is absolutely true now that the joy was in the journey. Like it was absolutely as we sat together and we came up with 85 recipes and, you know, brought everybody together for a week-long photo shoot and we have stories with each recipe. It became very clear that this is our family legacy. 

And so it’s recipes for connection and gathering and what really solidified this as like this was meant to be and really just so special for our family was my brother has struggled with addiction and substance abuse for the last two decades. My family tree, although it’s not full of like pioneer heritage, it is full of mental health and suicide and substance abuse and addiction. 

And we just felt like we wanted to give 100% of the proceeds towards mental health and substance abuse and addiction, not only recovery, but prevention. And that, you know, connection is prevention. Connection is prevention, whether it’s cell phones, whether it’s pornography, whether it’s, you know, drugs, alcohol, it is. And so Yeah. We partnered with like you talked about that connecting. I cannot do anything alone ever, right? I’m one woman. I cannot do a lot. 

But when I bring other people together into the table and we partner with Huntsman Mental Health, who is just disrupting the mental health space, not only here in Utah, but they’re really a lighthouse to the rest of the country and what they’re doing. Mental health is not working in our country right now at all. Right? Like it’s only getting worse and it’s just not going well. And so they are doing such unique, really interesting and impactful things that are across the country. And so 100% of the proceeds go to that. And the recipes are just fun and easy. They’re like grilled donuts. Like, go buy a donut, throw it on your Traeger, you know. Dips and chicken and it’s not fancy when people have been making it. They’re like, oh, my kids can make it or I actually had all the ingredients at my house. So.

Jody: And it’s beautiful and inspiring, which I love in a cookbook because I don’t love to cook to be honest, but when I with beautiful photos and the idea of gathering, I love having people over and I love I finally learned you can just use paper plates and nobody cares.

Kristin: You always use paper plates.

Jody: Kristin said you always use paper plates. Did everybody hear that? Nobody cares. Yeah. And I don’t know how to do a beautiful tablescape, but that’s okay. I know how to buy some flowers at Trader Joe’s and throw them on the table for me, like you said, nobody else even cares if I do that. But for me, you know, so yeah, it’s so beautiful. Tell people the name and where to get it.

Kristin: Yeah, so it’s called Life at our Table. It’s on KristinAndrus.com, but it is a pre-order right now and the book should be coming in July. So it’s been just, I think it sold out truly not just because of the recipes, but because of the mission. This, you know, substance abuse and addiction and mental health touches every single family. The number of people that line up after our events and say me too, me too, my daughter, my mom, my, you know, it touches all of us. And so it’s been a really neat thing to be a part of.

Jody: I love the mission and it’s I think a cookbook like that is such a fun little gift. You get a cute, you know, spatula and dish towel and tie it all up together. It’s a great hostess gift, birthday gift, whatever. So, and then you’re contributing to this great mission. So I love it.

Kristin: Or ask your friends to each take a picture, you know, if they don’t have the book, picture of a recipe and say everybody bring a recipe for Sunday dinner, come over, super casual pull out the paper plates. And it’s just something fun, you know, there’s always a reason to get together.

Jody: Yeah. Kristin, you know I’m a big fan of yours and… 

Kristin: Right back at you. 

Jody: So grateful to you for all the work you’re doing and for taking the time to come on and share with us. Come back again, would you?

Kristin: I would love it. And I use your Model literally this morning talking to 500 HXP people. I spoke at women’s conference. I used your model. Like I am your evangelist. Thank you, you’ve changed my life and thank you. You’ve changed my mom’s life, which is really good for all of us.

Jody: I love your mom. So helpful. You’re the best.

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Oh wow, look at that. You made it to the end. Your time and attention is valuable, and I don’t take it lightly that you made it this far. In fact, it tells me you might be like me; insatiably curious about people and life and potential and connection. Maybe you have big dreams but a small budget and no time. You’re tired, but bored. You’re content, but dissatisfied. Sound familiar? Come to a free coaching call and see for yourself what’s possible: JodyMoore.com/freecoaching to register. That’s JodyMoore.com/freecoaching.